Living large as a baby boomer

Dave Frost: [00:00:00] The idea of not throwing in the towel, throwing up the white flag to say, I give up, I’m getting old, if everybody could do that little bit extra, maybe they would be a centenarian that has purpose, that plays with the grandkids, that just loves life.

Peter Bowes: [00:00:22] Hello again, and welcome to LLAMA, the Live Long and Master Aging podcast. I’m Peter Bowes. This is where we explore the science and stories behind human longevity.

SPONSOR MESSAGE: [00:00:31] This episode is brought to you in association with JUVICELL, the all-in-one longevity supplement that contains 10 key ingredients shown to have a positive impact on healthspan as validated by scientific studies. To find out more, visit JUVICELL.com. That’s JUVICELL.com. 

Peter Bowes: [00:00:53] Baby boomers make up about a fifth of the population of the western world, those of us born between 1946 and 1964. Now in our late 50s, 60s and early 70s, represent a vibrant generation that is still working. Some are retired. Many are active, fit and living life to the fall. Increasingly, the image of boomers is that of one of the most healthy generations ever. Let’s talk about what it’s like to be a boomer in 2021 and the potential challenges and opportunities ahead. My guest today is Dave Frost. Dave is the author of the book Kaboomer:Thriving and Striving 1990s. Dave is also the founder of Well Past Forty, a company that promotes wellness and fitness for athletes of all ages and abilities, with particular emphasis on nutrition, endurance and strength, training for people with cancer, neurological conditions, diabetes and metabolic syndrome. Dave, welcome to the Live Long and Master AgeUp podcast.

Dave Frost: [00:01:58] Peter, what a pleasure to be here on this waning day of winter. You and I are both kind of bundled up a little for Southern California winter, aren’t we?

Peter Bowes: [00:02:06] Yeah, we are. You were both in the same state. We are both wrapped up inside. Actually, I went for my traditional morning hike this morning. It’s actually a beautiful morning, biting cold first thing in the morning. But the sun rises and the birds are tweeting. It feels like spring is in the air.

Dave Frost: [00:02:20] And it is as and it’s almost upon us, our days and nights are about equal in duration, and although we know that we sometimes spend too much screen time when we should be out in nature enjoying natural sunlight as much as we can and enjoying the heavens when the sun goes down, that’s technology. And like you said, that’s the 21st century. So we adapt, don’t we?

Peter Bowes: [00:02:42] We do that is modern day life for you, so we’re going to talk about being a baby boomer. Let’s get age out of the way for both of us. I’ve just turned 59, born in 1962. So the younger end of the boomer demographic. How about you?

Dave Frost: [00:02:57] Smack dab in the middle, Peter, I’m a ’53 birth, so I am smack dab in the middle of this rather unique demographic population. As you mentioned, we’re in our encore years. Neither you and I look like we’re in our encore years, but we are. And we want to make the most of them, don’t we? We could be the last third of our lives. And if we believe Shakespeare, it could be the best act yet. So, yeah, there are a lot of us, all of us acquire almost all of us acquire aches and pains, creaky joints and aging. We know aging is unavoidable, but we don’t have to get old. So I’m smack dab in the middle of a very interesting generation. Lots of spending power, which sometimes relates to fitness as it relates to technology and ways to become an athlete at any age. Yeah, what a fascinating demographic. So enjoy the trailing edge of the generation Peter.

Peter Bowes: [00:03:50] I will try to and if we’re in our encore years, I’d like to think of the curtain continually coming down and then rising again to do another performance to keep on going.

Dave Frost: [00:04:00] You know, that’s exactly right. And you mentioned the corporation that I founded to try to promote wellness for others Well Past Forty, the decade of the 40s that you and I experienced well, a few solar laps ago. That was tough. We had dependents. We had issues at work. We had challenges. And that’s really the bottom of the happiness curve. So shame on us if we don’t figure out ways to make these encore years our best years.

Peter Bowes: [00:04:28] And KaBoomer, which is a word in the title of your book, how did you come up with that and what does it mean to you?

Dave Frost: [00:04:34] Well, KaBoomer is a little bit extra, and if I may, in the intro of the book, I do share a knock knock joke. You and I probably did not knock when we are growing up in

Peter Bowes: [00:04:43] Oh, yes.

Dave Frost: [00:04:44] Their early years. Well, there’s a knock knock – a boomer and a KaBoomer knock on the door, so. Knock, knock. Who’s there? A boomer and a KaBoomer who? Well, a boomer who may take two pills at a time and a KaBoomer is more apt to take two steps at a time. So that’s a sort of an implicit theme about things that bother you and me. Polypharmacy, letting age conquer us instead of us conquering aging. I mean, your whole thesis for living longer and living better is about maybe shying away from pharmaceuticals and band aids like drugs and Madison Avenue feel good kinds of things and get down to doing the work to live longer and live better. So KabBoomer came up. I had a very wonderful guy named Tim who was a creative guy, and he said, you know, Dave, you kind of need you’re talking about a pretty powerful generation, Peter, you mentioned. But what is it what is that subset of boomers that want to do that little bit extra? You know, the difference between ordinary and extraordinary is that little bit extra. A KaBoomer thinks about prudent steps to do that little bit extra. Maybe it’s Dolly Parton, maybe it’s Bruce Springsteen, maybe it’s Governor Schwarzenegger. Maybe it’s Peter Bowes. You know, what can we do to live longer and live better? Some things are simple yet hard. Some things may be unobtainium, but I think we can all figure out ways to enhance the activities of daily life, play with the grandkids and enjoy that happiness curve that you mentioned that you curve. We should be on the upswing and shame on us if pandemics get us down again. Each of us faces our own individual challenge, but each of us is our own individual athlete and is each of us an athlete, the founder of Nike, not Phil Knight, but the founder of Nike, Bill Bowerman, said each of us is an athlete. So I really hope that people realize that they don’t have to be couch potatoes, that they don’t have to succumb to the aging process, that you can master it and celebrate it and again, enjoy that happiness up curve. So, yeah.

Peter Bowes: [00:06:54] Exactly, and I want to delve into some of that with you, first of all, though, just tell me about your background, your professional life. What have you spent the past few decades doing?

Dave Frost: [00:07:06] Well, I have been around a few blocks a few times, I’m not the David Frost that hails from the country. I was not knighted by the Queen, but but this David Frost was a Vermonter by birth. I was lucky enough to attend the US Naval Academy during the Vietnam era, which shaped many of our lives. You know, Watergate and Woodstock and all those other things of the 60s and 70s. But I was honored to wear the fabric of our nation as a naval officer in the Cold War years. And that scared the bejesus out of me. You know, the Russians were coming, the Russians were coming. But then getting into my 40s, I joined corporate America and worked for businesses as small as one person, my own, and worked for large corporations in the defense and aerospace industry. And, you know, age happens. We don’t have to get old, but we get older. As we get older, we find out sometimes we like working for ourselves. So I stepped down from working for corporate America, thinking on my own journey that I lessons I picked up on my own. I might be able to share with others and maybe those folks could better their journeys. So interestingly enough, September 2001 is a very meaningful period for all of us. I found myself in England on a business trip to suggest before I stepped down from corporate America and I just suffered a rather religious sciatica and radiculitis from my L5 S1 disc. I had a herniated disc which ultimately led to surgery and I was not a happy camper and my fitness was not good, my mental well-being was not good. My quality of life frankly was pretty lousy. So when I got home after that, my own personal struggles, getting home from England and of course our country rising from the ashes after 9/11, I thought maybe it was time for me to do something. And what did I want my epitaph to say, Peter? You know, I joke about what do I want my epitaph to say? Well, Shakespeare, it’s a good one. Some other some comedians have some great ones. But, you know, one that I really like that I’ve shared with others is is LaLanne’s this gentleman kind of established an industry on his own, the fitness industry, his epitaph, jack LaLanne’s epitaph is and he died, I believe, at the age of ninety four, ninety five, doing what he wanted to do. It’s better to wear out than rust out. So, you know, by motion, by doing activities of daily life, by having purpose until the day you die, hopefully you’re going to wear out, not rust out. That’s kind of an epitaph that kind of hangs around. I do mention it occasionally. So it obviously is stuck in my brain, but I think there’s something there. The purpose of motion is medicine. Moving heavy stuff is extraordinary. Taking those hikes like you did, uphill, downhill, not always on flatland. Those are the things that challenge us to be athletes. And those are the things that hopefully will help us keep from rusting out. That’s an epitaph. And I haven’t decided what mind you’d say. It’s probably going to be on an urn because I know that it’s probably the way to go. So back to your question about where have I been the last decades? I’m kind of looking ahead to where ultimately I’m going to be in an urn and what do I want the urn to say? It’s going to be something hopefully as pointed as Jack LaLanne’s epitaph.

Peter Bowes: [00:10:25] Let’s hope that’s a few decades in the future.

Dave Frost: [00:10:28] That’s the plan, but.

Peter Bowes: [00:10:29] Yeah, exactly, that’s the plan. Let’s focus on you mentioned 9/11 and the impact that that had on you and you changed your direction. Did it involve a certain amount of reeducation because you essentially became a teacher, didn’t you?

Dave Frost: [00:10:43] It really did I did become an adult and adults are adult learning at adjunct faculty member learning. There’s an old adage about a students teach students how to work for C students. Well, I kind of flipped that. I’m kind of a C student that loves trying to help other people with practical lessons in life. So as an adjunct professor for working adults, I teach practical things, lessons of my own. So I try to encourage folks to learn from my mistakes and maybe my demis successes so that they don’t make the same mistakes I did and they can go on to their own successes. So, yes, I very much became a teacher. I am kind of. And I’ve often been accused of trying to tell people how to watch words when they just want to know what time it is. So I do a lot of research, Peter, and the more I learned about my own journey, my own injuries, how to deal with them, how to deal with what you have so many great guests talking about the idea of not throwing in the towel, throwing up the white flag to say, I give up, I’m getting old. I learned a lot. And I do believe my almost fervent religious conviction is we can all do better. Some things are hard, but some things are simple. And if everybody could do that little bit extra, maybe they would be a Blue Zoner themselves. Maybe they would be a centenarian that has purpose, that plays with the grandkids, that just loves life. You don’t have to live in the Mediterranean or Okinawa or Loma Linda. The only blue zone in the United States is Loma Linda, the Seventh Day Adventists

Peter Bowes: [00:12:22] Right, I’ve been there. 

Dave Frost: [00:12:23] And their lifestyle, low stress, wonderful outdoor lifestyle, very much community and not too much meat. So lots of things related to diet that help you become a better athlete, hopefully offset aging and hopefully let you thrive and strive. So kind of a long winded wrap around answer, but there’s lots of little things, Peter, I believe that folks can do. But, you know, it’s really hard. Sometimes we get besieged in our twenty first century. We get besieged by data and information. But it’s the job of people like you and me to turn that information into knowledge and wisdom. Hopefully my experiences, maybe they’re not like the grasshopper that David Carradine played the grasshopper in a great show of our our younger days. But if I’m not a grasshopper, maybe I don’t have wisdom. But I, I read the wisdom of others and hopefully I can share that with folks so that they filter the wheat from the chaff and know what’s actionable knowledge, not just what Madison Avenue said about, you know, take this elixir before bedtime and you’ll be three pounds lighter tomorrow morning. You see him? I see them. I hit delete hundreds of times a day with

Peter Bowes: [00:13:38] Yeah.

Dave Frost: [00:13:39] Things that just don’t pass the credibility test.  So, yeah, I did get into teaching. I am a coach for rowing. I work with disabled athletes. The veteran administration has a wonderful program for wounded warriors called Freedom Rose. You know, because your home country is such a wonderful growing country, what a great sport that is. And that was a sport that I cut my teeth on and still do. And I believe if you can get up from the chair, you could row work all the muscles in your body. The mind body alignment is there. You feel good, you sleep better, you eat better, you feel good about your accomplishments. So, yeah, coaching is something. Well, coaches and we’re all athletes. We all have lessons to share and hopefully we will share something. I know the technology sometimes makes us more private instead of more social. I think it’s something is as masterful as living longer and living better. Your underpinnings of your wonderful podcast. I think we can all be coaches and share our experiences to make everybody Surete a little bit better.

Peter Bowes: [00:14:43] And as far as your own personal health is concerned, you’re really speaking through example, aren’t you? Because as you’ve just described, you hit a low point with some medical conditions, but you came back from that. So you understand what it’s like to be to be down and facing that uphill struggle.

Dave Frost: [00:15:01] 1You know, that is he’s got the right that I called it a Phoenix like event, in my case it was spinal fusion and I had to give up something I loved, which was distance running. I’m a pretty big guy, but I, I, I had marathons under three hours, you know, pretty good clip for a big dude. But after spinal fusion, the doctor said you’re going to have another spinal fusion if you keep running. I had good mechanics, but I’m a big guy. And the doc said, I think you need to do something laterally instead of up and down. So I got back into the sport of rowing, which I did in college after twenty nine years off. And that, frankly, was part of the coaching experience and that is part of what changed my life, that I could overcome my own setback, a physical injury and the lessons I learned under the mentorship of some wonderful coaches. I hope I can kind of pass it to pay it forward, so to speak. But I have nowhere near the challenges that other people have had at the wounded warriors or people with severe long haul covid things to deal with. And if I could just take a quick aside there. One of the things I’ve learned from that first principles kind of guy, Peter, I’m not a you know, I don’t have a lot of initials after my name for advanced degrees in biochemistry or anesthesiology, but I do think that some things are important. Breathing is so important and recent studies, which I think are very, very, very credible, these hundreds and maybe thousands, I don’t know the statistics, but those folks that may never be the same after they got covid-19 breathing is supposed to improve their quality of life because they’re juggling their O2 and CO2 equation. They’re being biochemist by breathing better. You know, I believe that the cardio respiratory system is lots of signals and lots of muscles and lots of things that have to go right. But breathing is something we can do and it certainly isn’t expensive to do. Something like that is one of those simple yet hard things to get people to realize special warriors in the British special services or the Navy SEAL community or other warriors have to learn how to breathe. That works well in stressful situations. But hey, long haul covid survivors are in a stressful situation and in breathing techniques are so important for reducing stress, getting the blood pressure under control, something as a layman, I say something as simple yet hard as breathing. Peter is something that we should stop strangers and say, How are you breathing today?

Peter Bowes: [00:17:35] Yeah, I absolutely agree with you, I think it’s a fascinating subject, I’ve learned recently the power of of breathing to get to sleep. Oftentimes

Dave Frost: [00:17:43] Oh.

Peter Bowes: [00:17:44] If you’re lying awake, as we all do at certain points in our lives, are you lying awake in bed? And of course, one of the keys is not to be thinking about anything, not to be worrying about anything, to lower the stress levels of your life. But nevertheless, if you find yourself having a sleepless night, the power of purposefully deep breathing is enormous.

Dave Frost: [00:18:03] I hope you stop strangers, Peter, and share that, because, yes, you know, those deep breaths and that good morning routine when you go to the east, that good morning yoga routine so important that mindful breathing to celebrate oxygen. Yet also remember the importance of CO2, that exchange of how you breathe and how you handle carbon dioxide. Those are things that are helping, apparently helping a significant number of those covid long haul survivors who get the word that breathing is important. So, yes, thank you. I believe that those simple yet hard things are a big deal for KaBooming.

Peter Bowes: [00:18:40] Dave, we’re going to pause for a moment. We’ll continue our conversation in less than a minute. You’re listening to the Live Long and Master aging podcast.

SPONSOR MESSAGE: [00:18:48] This episode is brought to you in association with JUVICELL a novel all in one longevity supplement that includes 10 key research backed ingredients shown in scientific studies to support healthspan things like resveratrol, fisetin, quercetin, pterostilbene, sulforaphane and turmeric…all in a single dose. If you’re interested in supporting your longevity, you probably already have a cabinet full of these single ingredients at home. JUVICELL is the first product to combine them all into a single supplement to support your healthspan. It’s also vegan, non GMO and sustainable. To find out more, visit JUVICELL.com. That’s JUVICELL.com.

Peter Bowes: [00:19:32] I’m talking to Dave Frost, the author of KaBoomer thriving and Striving into your 90s. Dave, I want to go back to something you said a few moments ago. You say you are a long distance runner. For a number of years. I think I’ve run five marathons during my life. I didn’t quite achieve your sub three hour marathon, but I was a reasonable runner. I don’t do those long distance runs anymore and I really miss it. I just wondering, do you miss the runner’s high?

Dave Frost: [00:19:59] Absolutely, thank you for asking. You know, there are those endorphins isn’t it amazing that our bodies can generate morphine like substances naturally, and if we get more people to do that and maybe some of those oxy opioid like, things wouldn’t happen if you can use your own body to reduce suffering and pain. But, yeah, the runner’s high. It varies by individuals. But for me, it generally at the clip that I would run distances at between 40 and 50 minutes. That second wind happened, those those endorphins kicked in and you feel that you could run or roll forever. So it’s not just running. But I do find that it was most notable for me striding around the countryside, hopefully on grass, not on asphalt, but wherever you can run sand level, sand trails, whatever, nothing like a runner’s high. And I would encourage anyone with good mechanics to try to find a zone where they could experience their own morphine’s naturally. Oh, boy, do I miss it. I do get rowers. I do. But it’s not it’s just a little bit different than the contact with the ground. Being on the water is awesome, but the always high runners high. Absolutely, Peter. Nothing like it. Nothing

Peter Bowes: [00:21:15] Yeah, I agree with that and just listening to you talk there, it kind of brings back memories of the the sequence of events during a marathon and the thought process occurs as you’re running those twenty six point two miles. And it was always one of my goals to run quite slowly for the first few miles. I remember people running too fast to the beginning and then you end up passing them later because they’ve just run out of steam. So my plan was to run slowly for the first part. And then, as you say, you kick in after about maybe six or 10 miles. And that’s the sweet spot in terms of really feeling good. And then the feeling of the final six miles, which, let’s face it, is pretty tough. But you learn after a while a way to get through that and you kind of sequence the way that you run every single mile and and try to hit a certain time duration. It’s by that point in the the marathon, it’s mind over matter to a large extent. But I still recall are all of those signposts during the 26 miles.

Dave Frost: [00:22:12] Masterful description of something that changed my life, and I truly do miss the distance running, I will mention, Peter, as you know, a downside to exercise is information. There are four things that impact us in an inflammatory way. Smoking too much sunlight, too much stress. And it could be environmental toxins or stresses on your stresses and strains on your mental well-being. But the fourth thing that really induces those free radicals is exercise. We don’t we didn’t run marathons to lose a pound of body fat. That’s about what it is, isn’t it? So twenty one miles or 42K to to lose a pound of body fat. That’s not why we did it. We did it for the mental challenges. We did it for the accomplishment. We did it for the the rush and the feel good that, hey, not many people run marathons. But do keep in mind that with that exercise, is that information that you have to deal with, with rest, with what I call vitamin P, those polyphenols and flavonoids and things from the ground. I call it vitamin P for plant macros and micronutrients to restore your body. I’m in awe of ultra athletes, but I don’t see. And of course this may be a timing thing, but I don’t see many ultra athletes living longer than you or me. That’s a lot of information on their body. They create cytokine storms in a different way than a pandemic covid does. Yet the cytokines are still those little chemical triggers. And if we have too many inflammation cytokines that we don’t rebuild, restore, recover from, we’re not going to get better. We’re not going to celebrate marathons. We’re going to get worn down, get sick, those kinds of things. So it’s kind of that, as you mentioned, it’s masterfully knowing your body and knowing your mind and connecting those two for athletic accomplishment and lifelong gains without being a little too aggressive in creating inflammation. Yeah, it’s

Peter Bowes: [00:24:22] It’s interesting what you say about athletes, I think the science shows that whether it’s an ultra athlete or just a regular top notch athlete, they don’t necessarily enjoy great longevity. They’re very focused on their sports, usually while they’re younger. But it’s it’s a very narrow focus on being a great footballer or hockey player or whatever the chosen sport is. And just interesting to me that the science shows that they don’t necessarily live longer because living longer is about more than just focusing on a narrow area. It brings in all sorts of other disciplines.

Dave Frost: [00:24:56] And what a fascinating topic and yes, I believe that there is a you know, there curves in life. There’s that happiness curve that you and I discussed. But there’s also kind of a proven rule of thumb because of how our bodies work. This these wonderful skeletal, muscular, neuromuscular cardiorespiratory systems of ours based on nutrition, of course, and sleep. There’s a tail off after about, let’s say, an hour of aerobic exercise in the right zone. It’s a tail off of gain versus investment. So if you looked at it from a physical banking sense, yes, you could run ten hours. But are you going to be that much healthier than if you only ran two hours? The answer is probably not. And there’s that issue of inflammation. So not only you don’t get as many physical the return on your investment of aerobic performance, it tails off. But then you also have the issue of the inflammation and injury and those sorts of things from overuse as we get older. So, yeah, there is a great poem about an athlete dying young. We want people to be athletic. But the blue zones that we broached earlier, it’s activities of daily life, it’s moderate exercise, and it doesn’t have to be three hours straight. It can be broken up as long as motion is your daily medicine, six days a week. So, yeah, you know, Satchel Paige, that great Negro League Baseball player who actually got into the pros for a few games, I believe Satchel Paige reminded us that moderation was a good thing. Exercise is powerful, but you can take things to the limit and be extreme. And A, that’s not me. I envy people that swim the English Channel or or climb Kilimanjaro. But to me, forty two or twenty one miles is just fine.

Peter Bowes: [00:26:51] Yeah, and I think as we get older, maybe this is something you teach with the people that you work with, perhaps people who’ve been very active in their younger lives that clearly you have to modify. But there are still ways of mimicking, let’s say that runner’s high that you talked about, my sport, my chosen sport, now is swimming. I think it’s one of the best sports. As you get older, it’s a solitary sport. You get into the lane, you get into that zone. But I set goals for myself and I’m now up to just over a mile of a swim, maybe two or three times a week. And, you know, you can look at the clock there, look at your watch and just set small goals, small steps, and you can mimic that sense of achievement in just a different way.

Dave Frost: [00:27:34] Oh, very much so, and in some ways, you’re honoring those millions of years of evolution, if we do believe that years ago some reptile crawled out or some fish crawled out of the water, and somehow we’re here standing on two legs. So that extraordinary journey of evolution is, I think, something to honor. The ability to power yourself through water is a hard yeah. A lot easier if you know the technique, but it’s so soothing. It stretches you out. Oh, it’s it’s like and the scenery doesn’t change. Which gets back to one of your comments about how important the mind is. I don’t know if you have a great playlist in your head or, you know, just focus on your breathing. But I did find in my own journey after my Phoenix experience in September 2001, after I got my surgery, the first thing I did was walk in the pool. I found out how hard walking in a pool is. It’s tough on your feet,

Peter Bowes: [00:28:32] Yeah.

Dave Frost: [00:28:33] But it was all I could do. But then when I finally was able to go horizontal and swim, I learned that I had to find ways to celebrate an hour or an hour and a half of being a mermaid. I’m not obviously not a mermaid, but, you know, that sort of thing. So I applaud swimmers. I wish I’ve often said that I should learn how to swim better. My naval background. We had to do survival swimming and a lot of swimming, but I was never very good at it.

Peter Bowes: [00:28:58] Hmm, I find swimming is just great for thinking time. I find

Dave Frost: [00:29:02] Oh.

Peter Bowes: [00:29:02] It quite difficult to completely switch off, but it’s just great because no one can get to you. There’s no telephone. There’s no TV screen. You are just you the water and that lane. But there’s your mind. And I often forget how many laps I’m swimming because it doesn’t really matter. But thinking about something, maybe there’s something you want to work through in your mind and you can spend an hour swimming and you solve a problem at the same time.

Dave Frost: [00:29:29] It’s a wonderful Zen like experience, I believe,

Peter Bowes: [00:29:32] Yeah.

Dave Frost: [00:29:33] And if folks say, well, I don’t have a pool, that’s too bad. But there are some of these ones that folks pop in their backyard where there’s a current. So you just swim against the current. Now, that would be tough on my mind to stay in the same place.

Peter Bowes: [00:29:48] Yeah,

Dave Frost: [00:29:48] But.

Peter Bowes: [00:29:48] I’ve often thought about the I think they’re a great luxury, but I actually quite I mean, we live in California. There are some great public pools, Olympic size, public pools in California. I’m lucky enough to have one just a few miles from my house. And thank goodness, during covid, they’ve stayed open with some restrictions, booking ahead to to get your lane and social distancing and that kind of thing. But once you’re in that lane, you’re pretty safe. And I was listening to a woman there the other day, an older woman saying how it had been something of a lifesaver for her to be able to get out of the house and get some exercise through swimming. So there are plenty of places to go. And just the experience of going, you’re in public. There are other people that this is during the Covid times as well. I don’t think you necessarily need the luxury of having a pool in your back garden.

Dave Frost: [00:30:33] True, so I hope that more people can think about getting to water to power yourself through, get a Zen like experience, stretch your body out, use every muscle in your body, work your lungs in your heart. And when you get out, hey, get a little sun. Well, again, we’re blessed to be where we are, but get a little exposure to vitamin D and just feel awesome. I can’t remember ever not sleeping like a baby after having a good lapse when ocean swim. I am not quite as good. I’m nearsighted. And, you know, for events like a triathlon, I found that I swam way more than the mile because, you know, my ocean compass was not very good. I admire folks that are distance swimmers for sure. Open water swimmers. My hat goes off to him. But I’d rather at this point in my life, I’d rather skim across the surface of the water than plow through it as a good swimmer.

Peter Bowes: [00:31:31] Yeah,

Dave Frost: [00:31:31] So.

Peter Bowes: [00:31:31] We could swap stories all day, you and I. Reminds me of what one of the triathlons I did in California, the swim portion was out in the Pacific, off Malibu. And I’m not a great ocean swimmer either. I much prefer a pool. But that was part of the the triathlon. And I remember a day of training. As you well know, the Pacific is pretty cold most of the time. But we were out there, you know, a wetsuits, just three of us swimming Sunday morning. There was a lifeguard on the beach, thank goodness. And I just noticed this huge fin approach, the three of us, as we were out there swimming and I’m colorblind, it was actually difficult to see what kind of creature this was. But what comes to mind, sharks do exist out there and it’s certainly set the adrenaline going. And we headed back to that beach, I think, faster than we’ve ever swum before for the lifeguard to explain that it was almost 99 percent a dolphin because there are some great schools of dolphins out in the Pacific. It was a great experience. And swimming in the Pacific, swimming in any ocean is, as you’ve described it, is very, very different to being in a pool. And it’s pretty tough.

Dave Frost: [00:32:38] There’s a skill set, and again, I truly admire the folks who do that ultimate triathlon on Kona, so they go from, what is it, a three mile swim, albeit in warm water in Hawaii to one hundred and twelve mile bike ride across the lava fields in that humid and hot environment. And then to finish up with a 26 earlier. I apologize. I said twenty one miles. I meant twenty six miles for the marathon,

Peter Bowes: [00:33:03] Right.

Dave Frost: [00:33:03] But to finish up on a hot day after eight or 12 or 14 hours to finish up with a marathon, those folks, I tip my hat to them. Frankly, I never had an aspiration to be a full triathlete. I joked recently I did a half marathon on the rowing machine and did very well for my age group. But I joked with my rowing peers that my religion says I shouldn’t do a full marathon on the rowing machine. And friends don’t let friends do full marathons on the rowing machine. But so I really tribute Ultra’s and I will never, never, never disparage the accomplishments of somebody that does something either half a many an Olympic distance triathlon, because it’s a multi it’s like CrossFit. It’s doing many things in many different ways on your body. I tribute those folks, but it does take an extraordinary amount of time to train properly for those things. And as we get older in our encore years, we do want to marshal our times to the things that enter in. You know, could it be grandkid’s, maybe looking at your stock portfolio or whatever? So those things take valuable time as well. So to train well does take many hours. And if folks can do it, God bless them. And I just and a lot of them. But I’m quite happy to settle for sometimes lesser distances.

Peter Bowes: [00:34:23] Yeah, exactly, so I’m curious, with your athleticism, with your very positive attitude, what are your aspirations for the future? It’s a question I usually ask my guests towards the end of the interview. This is a podcast about longevity. Do you spend much time thinking about your own longevity and what your life might be like in 10, 20, who knows, 30, 40 years time?

Dave Frost: [00:34:49] Thank you for asking and, you know, isn’t that something it’s hard to predict the future Yogi Berra, that great American philosopher, said that  you know, the world that changed a lot after Yogi passed away, but the future is hard to predict. Tactically, I would love to throw a seven minute into a rowing speed for two thousand meters at the age of 70, generally for Crossfit athletes and others. If you can throw a two thousand meter piece in seven minutes or less, your overall body strength and your endurance is pretty darn good. And my goal here in a little less than two years is to try to prove that I can row a seven minute 2000 meter piece, which is about 14 kilometers an hour, something like that human powered, not swimming, but skimming across, pushing a boat through the water. That’s my tactical goal for two years. But I think the main thing and thriving and striving into your 90s, the subtitle of the book, Peter, really means that enjoying life, living large and at our age old age, but aging with our knowledge and treachery, we can learn how to have quiet time. Those walks that you take in the morning, how precious that is to make the rest of your day productive. I have read that many, many, many very successful executives Sir Richard Branson, Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, all exercise because they know the importance of mind body alignment, cleansing the brain. Heck, I personally believe as a layman that aerobic exercise helps Plack from building up in the inner part of your brain for Alzheimer’s and dementia kind of things that we might be able to fend off. The benefits of exercise in motion as medicine are extraordinary. So I want to keep moving now. Now what would happen if you were in a traumatic car accident and were not able to use your legs or something? I would have to adapt. You mentioned adaptation earlier. I believe that to keep breathing, you’ve got to move to keep breathing well and long you’ve got to move. So my goal is to keep moving.

Peter Bowes: [00:36:54] Dave, that’s hugely inspiring, thank you very much indeed, all the best with the book, with the company and the people that you work with. They must be an inspiration to you.

Dave Frost: [00:37:03] They are I learned so much from clients of all ages, of all backgrounds, of all physical capabilities, but again, Peter, each one of them is a unique athlete. And if we can think about a spoken way to help them thrive and strive to take steps two steps two at a time rather than two pills at a time, I think we’ve done a great service to those individuals and maybe to society. I worry about health care costs for my kids because we’re living longer, except for covid. I know that’s a terrible statistic, that last year Americans mortality increased so that we are living shorter as a nation, but we can all do better. I believe it and we should not stop trying. That’s what Dolly Parton said. That’s the first line of my book. Never Stop Trying.

Peter Bowes: [00:37:47] And it’s a good line, Dave, thank you very much indeed. Really good to talk to you.

Dave Frost: [00:37:51] Peter, thank you so much and stay warm and keep enjoying them at the pool and those wonderful hike’s.

Peter Bowes: [00:37:56] I will thank you and I’ll put some details into the show notes about your book, about your company, about the work that you do, you’ll find them at the Live Long and Master aging website. That’s LLAMApodcast.com. LLAMApodcast.com. The LLAMA podcast is a Healthspan Media Production. If you enjoy what we do, you can rate and review us at Apple podcasts, you can follow us in social media at LLAMA podcast and direct message me at Peter Bowes. Stay safe. And many thanks for listening.